Harry Potter and the Order of the Phoenix – MOVIE – Episode 109
The Buddies weren’t too happy about the 5th Harry Potter movie, “Harry Potter and the Order of the Phoenix”, where apparently the longest book in the series got hit with a shrinking charm. The Buddies discussed many important topics including: Death Eaters’ and the Lost tv show crossover, Filch’s unexpected workout routine, and whether the movie’s pacing deserves to be thrown through the mysterious veil. So, grab your truth serum (which may or mayn’t be fake), avoid any suspicious-looking smoke clouds, and join us as dissect (attack) this movie for 45 minutes.
Intro (0:00-1:35)
Stock Up/Down (1:36-26:10)
Favorite Scene/Character (26:11-28:38)
Love/Hate (29:39-42:15)
Studio Notes (42:16-43:44)
Listener Email (43:45-45:02)
Conclusion (45:03-47:35)
NEXT BOOK: Harry Potter and the Half-Blood Prince by J. K. Rowling
Transcript for SEO purposes 🙂
Alright. Welcome to the book club. I’m Dylan here with which is the abbreviated and unintelligible version of Keith just like the movie is to the book. Keith, what’s up buddy? I thought you were speaking in partial mouth there.
Okay. I am not a partial mouth. No. We’re working out some box office bangers here at the Buddy Book Club, and this week, we’ll be discussing 2000 and seven’s Harry Potter and the Order of Phoenix, the film. If you’d like to recommend a book or movie for us to read or watch, you can reach out to us about past episodes on, buddybookclub.com or send us an OWL on Twitter or Instagram, Buddy Book Club Podcast.
You can listen to us on iTunes, Spotify, or every gear podcast. So give us a review. 5 stars, if you will. And, you know, give us a follow on social channels, please, and thank you. Keith, so we had done the Order of the Phoenix book, which you finished way before I did.
Sorry. Having a baby kinda threw me off there. And then I was excited to sit down and watch a movie because it took me so long to read the book. I feel like I hadn’t watched a Harry Potter movie in a while. With having the baby and sleeping schedules and with your significant other, you see each other, but you you don’t see each other because you’re kind of one person’s trying to get some sleep while the other person’s taking care of the baby and you’re you’re just kinda like 2 ships passing in the night.
So I felt like this was gonna be a great opportunity for us to sit down and, together, just enjoy a Harry Potter movie. You thought wrongly. We definitely got to sit down together, which was nice, but enjoy the Harry Potter movie. We did not. That being said, let’s get into some stock up stock down.
Keith, what do you have for stock up for this film? Yes. Stock up, the TV show Lost. Oh. Yeah.
Well, it’s just, for those who haven’t watched. That’s probably the most enthralling TV show I ever watched, at least the first three seasons. Binge watching was not a thing Yeah. Back in the day. That became a thing.
Well, for me, at least with Waz, that was the first show I ever binged. How did you binge it? It was on ABC. They used to do it on their own site. So it was abc.com.
Right. Right. And you go and just stream it. So I would just I’d get back. It was a college.
I’d get back and I’d just be like I gotta get like 3 episodes of Lost in right now. Like, you know, every between every class I was watching it. The problem was, as I pointed out and many I’m sure, is that a lot of stuff was never answered so it became pretty disappointing at the end. Yeah. One of the biggest things that wasn’t answered was what was the black smoke monster?
Mhmm. Well, it turns out they were just death eaters. Yeah. If they just said that, I would have understood and, honestly, that’s why it’s a stock up for Lost. But turning to the page to the Harry Potter side, what the hell did I just watch?
What was that fight scene, d man? That was the dumbest thing I’ve ever seen. And then the one thing I told talked about the book episode is I didn’t understand what the veil was. I was like, well, it’s gonna be great as the the movie’s gonna explain. Yeah.
You’ll see. Very visual appealing. The veil didn’t mean anything. In the the book, correct me if I’m wrong, he, like, gets knocked into the veil, and he and he’s dead. Well, he evaded cadavers or I think as you call it, like, abracadabras or something.
In the clip, you’re laughing at me saying that. I didn’t know that. I thought you’re laughing because that was funny that I said that. I’m mispronouncing it. Is that what you’re laughing there?
Yeah. Well, which is also funny because when we were watching the movie, I think Helen Bonham Carter, who plays Bellatrix Lestrange, the wife pointed this out. I’m pretty sure she says abracadabra. Like, I don’t think she actually says Avada Kedavra. She was like a Juilliard trained actor.
I’m pretty sure. So we’re on the same page. Yeah. But in the book, he he gets, abracadabra ed and then and then falls into the veil. Yeah.
Oh, I mean, he’s dead because he had abracadabra then. That was my whole point. It’s like there’s no mystery. If you get hit by a spell, a death spell, you’re you’re dead. It doesn’t matter that you went into the veil.
And I thought he got like, a stun spell and then, like, fell into it, and then he was, like, where did he go? And then they’re, like, yeah. He’s done. Yeah. I That’s what I thought.
Yeah. I mean, I I think I’d have to revisit it. I’m, like, almost certain, but maybe I’m just tainted from seeing the movie a few times that but, no, because Bellatrix kills him. You’re assuming if she just, like, stunned him and he went into that. But, yeah.
Yeah. I mean, there’s no really, like, mystery then if you shoot a killing spell at someone. They it’ll be like, the guy got shot in the head, but, like, then I didn’t see his body after it. It’s like, yeah. The but you saw the bullet go through his brain.
Right? It’s like, yeah. But what happened to him after that? It’s like, oh, he’s dead. What do you mean?
So So you didn’t like that fight scene? Oh, I hated it. What is the point of the, like, the the clouds of smoke coming and then the white clouds being the good guys, the black clouds coming and being the bad guys and, like, it’s like this is the dumbest thing. I don’t know. They’re just like, oh, this is what magic looks like.
Why don’t we just take the the source material and actually use spells? Mhmm. And, like, the worst part too is, like, the Dumbledore Voldemort fight. Yeah. It was just Star Wars where they’re doing, like, electricity and, like, blocking it instead of the book was perfect.
Like, why did you not just they spent all their budget on the the the special effects of the smoke, and they’re, like, we can’t spend any of it on in this fight. We’ll just do it to lightning bolts. They definitely couldn’t spend it on the centaurs. The centaurs looked like something from, I don’t know, 1995 or, like, or, like, David versus the Argonauts or whatever that, like, 19 sixties movie is with claymation. I was like, wait.
Good thing they’re not having any close ups of these centaurs because they’re terribly done. But I want to just quickly on the smoke thing because that’s obviously sticking in your craw. I had the death eaters as, like, I wasn’t sure if I loved or hated it because the costumes, like, the Death Eaters costumes, I think are phenomenal. The Death Eaters show up straight up in their costumes. Lucius Malfoy does little things, so, like, his mask kind of smokes away.
I was like, that’s cool. That’s super cool. Yeah, I was fine with that. And then when they all start doing the smoke monster stuff, I thought it was the dumbest shit I’d ever seen. I was like, wait, I’m confused.
So everyone just flies around as smoke, and then like they’re apparating, but they’re just flying around as smoke around the kids and whatnot. Why would you ever And it seems like they can cast spells from their smokes state, so it’s like why would you ever land? Like why would you ever assume this human shape? It seems like you’re impossible to hit when you’re a smoke monster. And I agree like the I understand obviously the contrasting versus like light and dark, but like where does that come from?
Why not just like you said, use the source material, have an actual battle where people are just standing and fighting, not this like pseudo apparition thing going on? Because I assume that’s what they’re doing. They’re like apparating but in slow motion. Yeah. It became a sci fi movie instead of a movie in the real world that has meant there was also some sort of logic base of like, hey, you need to learn these spells and everyone can cast different spells and some people are better at certain things and it’s a training.
And this is just like, oh, I’ll just turn into a magic smoke monster. We’ll just fly around. There’s like no particular strategy or anything going on. It’s just Yeah. It it went from like Harry Potter to Tron all of a sudden for I don’t even get it.
And I It’s a lost. Yeah. And I couldn’t agree with you more on the on the Dumbledore Voldemort thing because I had forgot a bunch about this movie because I hadn’t seen it in so long. And after reading the book, how we were pretty jazzed about that that Voldemort, Dumbledore fight because it was the one of the first ones that we felt like it wasn’t just people casting expelliarmus against each other, and it was like an actual, oh, this is real magic situation. And then they first connect with their wands, and I was like, oh, this is Star Wars.
I thought the exact same thing. I was like, oh, this is just emperor versus Yoda situation. They did mix in a couple of things, you know, Dumbledore with the fire snake and and, excuse me, Voldemort with the fire snake and Dumbledore with like the water stuff in the glass which I thought that part was pretty cool but just make the statues come to life and defend you or whatever the the things that were going on in the book. It just yeah. Unfortunately, they went for the spectacle which I feel like isn’t needed for diehard Harry Potter fans.
You know, a bunch of people that are going to go see this movie obviously aren’t diehard Harry Potter fans but they’re Harry Potter fans presumably or the parents of kids that are Harry Potter fans. So who cares about those people? They’re paying for their ticket anyways. So just just make it Harry Potter and don’t make it this new I don’t know. Like you said, this, like, new sci fi thing.
Yeah. I I couldn’t agree with you more. My first and I think my only stock up unfortunately here for this one, but we’re trying to abbreviate just like this movie did, whereas casting directors, so I have to stock up to casting directors. It’s not something we talk about ever in any of our few movie pods that we’ve done and not something I really think about, but I wanted to give a shout out to, Fiona Weir, who’s the casting director for this one. We do have a couple new characters like we talked about when we did the book version, but we have Luna, Umbridge, and Bellatrix.
And talk about going 3 for 3 at the plate. I mean, we got Evanna Lynch as Luna, which I think was like an open casting call. They they picked her out of, like, 15,000 applicants or something like that. So I feel like that’s equally easy and hard to pick out someone that’s that good. You probably just have a couple of minutes with people, and I thought she was the perfect Luna Lovegood.
What do you think? Yeah. I went 3 for 3, I thought. Yeah. Imelda Staunton as Umbridge did that character perfectly.
Her uhmes were were great. She was so hateable, which is exactly what we need. Wasn’t as toadish as she is in the book, which, I appreciate because Imelda seems like a a a nice person, and we didn’t wanna return her into a toad. And Helen Bonham Carter as Bellatrix, not necessarily her you thought it was more of a fight club situation, but crazier than that for sure. Yeah.
No. I thought it was on par hair wise and, like, I think her teeth were a little bit fucked up. But, yeah, otherwise, I mean, she just can play that role perfectly. Yeah. I guess they wanted the woman.
I can’t remember the the actress’s name is from Peaky Blinders who eventually plays Narcissa. So she was supposed to be the, the Bellatrix, but then she got pregnant. She was like, oh, I’m not gonna be able to do the fight scenes. I can’t become a smoke person if I have a baby in me. It’s like, you know, you can’t do that in your 1st trimester.
So re recasting her. You know, before we continue to go on this dark hole of of hating on this film, I think, those three characters, the the acting and just the way that they took that character on, I thought was perfect. I thought that was the truest love to the book itself was how these actors portrayed these characters. Did you have any of the stock ups? Yeah.
Last one was just, Cho Chang stock up. Oh, interesting. Came up pretty pretty good in the movie compared to the book, I thought. In the book, it’s obviously her friend who who gives them up and but then she defends them which we both didn’t care for. Mhmm.
But in this, she gives them up and it’s only because she’s influenced by the truth serum which in the book was fake. So that opens up another whole can of worms there, but I don’t think the truth serum was fake. You keep saying that, but I’m not sure it was in the book. Snape basically said that the the truth serum was fake. We need we need someone to check us out.
Yes. In Harry Potter the Lord of Phoenix, Snape does indeed give Dolores Umbridge a fake baricitarium, potion when Umbridge interrogates Harry Potter. She demands that he drinks. During interrogation, Harry drinks blood. Yeah.
Oh, okay. Good to know. Yeah. So, you yeah. You’re understood right.
Hand up. I’m a close reader. Yeah. Alright. I’m a close Anyways, where was it?
Yeah. With Cho. So this is really a hate in disguise. Honestly, I don’t know if it’s a stock up, but it’s really a hate disguise. 1, I I the middle of the night, I woke up and I was just thinking about this.
I was like, goddamn it. This pisses me off. Filch and Malfoy in the movie Mhmm. Know what the real requirement is. They see it.
Right? Yeah. Like that that’s a big change. Big montage. The the mystery is just like how they get in.
How do they get in there? So what does giving a truth serum to Cho do? It doesn’t make any sense. They give her a truth serum. So in essence would be to tell them where the room is, but they already know where it is.
And then okay. Fine. They give her the truth serum so they can get in. How do they get in there? They just blow the door down.
Yeah. So they didn’t need the truth serum at all. Cho didn’t need to tell them where it was. What is she in trouble for? Why do they use the it didn’t make any sense.
JK would never let this fly. And So whoever the screenwriters were, the directors were, what are we doing? It doesn’t make it’s just like a biggest plot hole. Makes the most sense at all. Yeah.
David Yates was the director. This was his first And he does all the rest of the movie. This is his first Harry Potter movie and really kinda like his first real movie. He was like a TV, director, and supposedly the producers hired him after a bunch of other people said no, which is always a a tough one. They hired him because I guess in the TV shows he had done some, like, British TV shows, it was kind of political, but not really hammering down on the politics.
It was more like using the rest of the story to kind of show this political ideology in rid of the cases. I don’t know. I’m saying that terribly, but I understand the idea because that’s kind of what this what this movie and this book is is it’s, you know, there’s a lot of politics going around in the wizarding world that Mhmm. Are touching Hogwarts all of a sudden, and Harry’s at the center of it with Dumbledore. So so I understand that why you’re trying to trying to tell a story, but also get this political stuff that’s going on in the society into it.
I don’t know if that’s the the number one reason to hire someone for for a story. I’m not gonna say it’s necessarily all his fault. I agree that the script was not good. It was the longest Harry Potter book, 870 pages in the US edition, so the longest Harry Potter book at the time. And it’s comes out to be the 2nd shortest film.
So I’m sure there was some studio pressure to shorten the film because the last goblet of fire was, like, almost 3 hours. Right? It was, like, 2 hours and 45 minutes. So they probably didn’t want another one of those. It it missed the mark, unfortunately.
And Mhmm. To your Cho point, the only problem I had with with that is it kinda makes it seem like Harry dumped Cho because she turned them in and then finds out later, oh, she didn’t turn him them in. Like it was, you know Right. Ferritos serum or whatever the case is. Because Harry gives this look when he finds out like, oh, shit.
Which I feel like would be you’d be able to fix that with Cho, you know. Right. Or she would just say They drugged me. Which they were doing to all the kids in the school. Mhmm.
Like I don’t know why that was added in. They already knew where the the room was. I mean, I don’t know. It just didn’t make any sense. Yeah.
And they also had that weird scene with the the Weasley twins when they’re, like, rubbing that little boy’s shoulder being, like, it hurts at first, but then it goes away. And I was like, what? And then I was like, oh, they’re Umbridge’s office. Got it. Turrets.
Well, I’m just saying. It’s like the what the line was. It was very confusing. Yeah. I used to like that too.
It really wasn’t. Yeah. They wasn’t also very implied. They should’ve just showed his hand. Yeah.
They didn’t. So you don’t you’re like, what are you doing? What’s going on? Yeah. They’re just, like, all up in this kid’s business, like, in his personal space telling him it hurts at first.
I was like, woah. Also to close it out, the river requirement, another stock down. You like it, but we got the mistletoe coming out when Harry gets his first kiss. Mhmm. And then he keeps kissing and he gets it keeps growing.
Mhmm. How about giving me a nice little bed there? You know, it’ll help my boy out a little bit. Yeah. That’s on you.
You know that. Indeed. Hopefully, you know, they’re they’re practicing, important stuff at at Hogwarts, and there’s some Trojans going on in the room of requirement for for him right there. Yeah. They also, they also show in that montage a few times, like, them sneaking out of a side door in the room of requirements, which one doesn’t exist.
But if it did, why wouldn’t they just do that when Umbridge came and blew the door down? Nice stock up, Keith. Really good. Really well done. My first stock down, because we’ll go there, is, CliffNotes stock down.
We’d have them lying around either like my sister had them or I’d buy them, whatever they can. Super useful. I feel like they’ve probably gone the way of the dough. Oh, you’re the physical one there? I went online once.
Oh, no. No. Yeah. I mean, we were, like, at that point. We both graduated high school in the early 2000.
So we were at that point when the Internet still hadn’t necessarily caught on and, like, the stuff you could find on there, I found wasn’t perfect. And go to the bookstore and they have these cliff notes you could buy for, like, $5 or whatever the case is. Yeah. We used to use it a lot. It’s funny.
I feel like now it just that just doesn’t exist anymore. But I just wanted to get some stock down to cliff notes because the the actual books themselves were quite useful. Like, they told exactly what the story was, you know, then they’d have some things in the back with, like, themes and whatever. You know, the stuff you’d normally find at the desk, very useful. It seems like they were trying to cliff note this book into a movie and unfortunately, they ruined the whole idea of cliff notes because they didn’t do a very good job of it.
And you know, I just wanted to call it a couple of things. Ron and Hermione being prefects, not included. I think that is somewhat important because it seems like what they wanted to do here was really focus on Harry and his, like, emotional journey through the book. I was gonna say, you could have just stopped at Ron and Hermione, not including getting into that at the prefect. They were, like, barely in the movie.
Yeah. And the prefect thing is a big early situation for Harry’s emotional journey is what the heck, Ron and Hermione are prefects and I’m not. I didn’t understand why that wasn’t included. Another thing is the Quidditch scenes, the entire Quidditch everything was taken out of this movie. How do you feel about that?
Because I personally think, yeah, it sucks, but I can understand if you’re trying to cut out a half hour, take out the Quidditch stuff. It’s not the most important. Yeah. No. I I was fine with it.
I don’t think it was crucial to this one. Yeah. It’s it’s unfortunate in the sense that I feel like the Quidditch is more of a Ron story in order of the Phoenix, the book. You know? And for Ron’s entire story arc throughout the series, it’s unfortunate because it show it’s like a big thing for him in terms of wanting to do something, failing at it miserably, and, you know, but then making his big save at the end or whatever the case is.
I think I think that’s that’s big for him. Unfortunately, we don’t get that in this. And, you know, for me, the biggest part of the cliff notes that was a stock down was that it seems like the middle portion of the book was just compressed and condensed into an in understandable or whatever the case is story that was mostly just like a series of montages, like Umbridge. Yeah. The entire Umbridge taking over Hogwarts, creating her special orders, sitting in on lessons to the creation of the inquisitorial squad and the sacking of Trelawney, which is several chapters in the book, was compressed down to one montage.
Up until the sacking of Trelawney, it was one montage. That’s my stock down. It’s montages. I’m a huge montage guy. Give me the give me Rocky training in the mountains.
Give me Rocky running through Philadelphia. Yeah. All montages, I’m a big fan of. I feel like oceans all the oceans movies have wonderful montages. Oh, yeah.
You’ve got a nice little, music track behind it. Oh, I’m all I’m all in. This movie just terrible. The montages they did to the worst one what by far was the the filter is now just the comic relief trying to get in. Yeah.
It was like, it was like Tom and Jerry like, It was very Looney Tunesy kinda situation. Exactly. Looney Tunesy. Do you remember, V for Vendetta, Stephen Fry Yeah. Who was the narrator?
Yeah. Exactly. Remember when he does the scene where he’s making fun of the chancellor and the terrorist guy with mask is running around the world? That music, you know, playing in the background. Benny Hill music on.
That was the whole scene with Filch. It was like this wacky music. We went from this, like, dark Harry’s disturbed and he’s possessed intro which I thought was great, actually. I thought the first, like, 15, 20 minutes was really good. And then we went to the from that to Umbridge which is great.
And then we hit a point where then montage just started and, like, newspaper clubbing started. Mhmm. And from there, it became Looney Tunes and silliness and, like, skipping, like, 90% of the story. It’s like, what’s going on? It didn’t it, like, it was a completely different movie all of a sudden.
Yeah. And that happened for the next, like, 70 minutes. So Yeah. I’m glad you brought up the the newspaper stuff too because it seemed like they were, like, doing exposition. I mean, they definitely were and, like, trying to say parts of the story through these, like, newspaper stuff, which I didn’t necessarily hate because I get the idea that, you know, that’s the political aspect is, you know, there’s a media portion to this and there is a media portion to the story itself too.
But then once again with the cliff notes, like, getting rid of the whole Rita Skeeter thing telling Harry’s side of the story and him getting shit on for that and then also that being the reason why Seamus comes back to him and says he believes him. I feel like that. You know, you could’ve just said that in a quick scene too. It didn’t have to be a big deal. It seems like Yeah.
They kinda just were pushing everything together as one and trying to tell the story. A lot of the stuff, I didn’t necessarily hate. I’m like, the some of the shifts that, like, who did what and when. The Weasley twins doing their fire thing, not like, their firecracker thing, not to help Harry get to the fireplace or whatever. You know, they just kinda take these out.
Like, Neville does the shows them the room of requirements instead of Dobby. Although, like, you know, we love Dobby, and Dobby’s a big character. The the later books and movie, you know, you have to have that emotional support. But at the same time, I’m alright with them. Not seeing Neville at Saint Mungo’s and instead Neville telling Harry, you know, the room requirements, those stuff is fine.
Like, I understand when you wanna, like, cut bigger scenes out to kinda compress them and change who did what and when as long as it still continues to tell the story. But just pushing everything together and then making it silly and not really in line with the theme of the book in my mind kinda pissed me off. I think they could also just not had Trelawney and made that scene Hagrid. That would have made way more sense. Okay.
Well, Trelawney is I don’t know anything about her in the story. She just comes in for one scene and then she’s getting fired and you’re like, alright, I guess. You’re not really pulling for her at all. Whereas if Hagrid gets fired in front of everyone, you’re like, what the fuck? It seems like a lot of interesting choices that didn’t add or help this the story at all.
I agree. What else, Chip? Having Harry’s back stuck down. Harry comes into the Gryffindor common room, like, early in the the movie and everyone’s murmuring and looking at him funny. And I know it’s there’s, like, division between even in Gryffindor.
But right there is Fred and George. And even they are looking at him, like, what do you like, what’s what’s Harry doing here? And then then Seamus this is, like, the most illogical thing I’ve ever heard in my entire life. Like, honestly, I almost, like, stopped the movie to rewind it because they walk in. It says, like, Harry on the front cover being, like, Harry is a complete piece of shit fraud.
He just saw someone get murdered right in front of his eyes 2 months ago. And they’re like Harry walks in. It’s like, what’s going on, guys? And he’s like, well, Seamus is having a really, really tough time. They’re like, why is that?
He’s like, well, his mom almost didn’t let him come to school. What? That’s your argument? Logic makes no you literally are talking to a guy that has his face on the cover of a newspaper saying this guy’s a piece of shit, and he just saw someone murdered. Everyone helping Seamus out.
What where is the logic in this? So it doesn’t make any sense. And then Fred and George don’t say shit. Like, in Fred and George are are regardless of what Harry has done for them or know about the orthopedics, they obviously know that. Mhmm.
They obviously are not just want wants to keep their mouth shut, would a 100% step up and and talk shit back to Seamus. They would defend his honor a 100% of the time. Plus, Harry just gave him a 1,000 galleons 2 months ago. They had the double motivation to do that. And they just sit back, and they’re like, yeah, Harry.
It’s like, it doesn’t make any sense, d man. Or they’d lean into it heavy and be like, Harry sucks. You know? And and Yeah. Yeah.
I wouldn’t have to. I’d be fine with that even. Yeah. Exactly. Just as, like, a a joke to them as, like, obviously, Harry doesn’t suck, but they were just leaning into it heavy.
And the and the worst part is, like, I I mentioned, we don’t really see Ron or Hermione much. Hermione were 3 words into the movie. Sirius just to, like, told them, like, yeah, people are disappearing. All this stuff’s happening. And Hermione, like this, like, dramatic moment.
We’ve already know about the art of Phoenix. We already know about Harry’s everything in the back story. Hermione looks off into the distance and says, wow, he’s really out there talking about Voldemort. It’s like, yeah. Where have you been?
Where have you where have you been this whole time? Oh, oh, he’s out there? I didn’t even realize that. In the movie canon, she was too concerned about not getting those letters at the end of last year that she forgot about the whole Voldemort thing. The letters from Harry and Ron went at the end of 4 when she’s like, you guys will write me.
Right? It’s like, wait. What? Voldemort’s back. You’re concerned about getting written to?
She she’s been checked out on this whole Voldemort thing since then. She’s like, guys, I just figured it out. Voldemort’s back. Like, what the hell? Yeah.
I felt like the whole all the school stuff in terms like the pressure for O. W. L. S was was really kinda taken out of it, which it’s it’s a long book. I get it.
But like you said, it’s just her Hermione and Ron just aren’t really big characters. They’re just, like, pieces set pieces in this thing. And I guess if you were to cut something, they spent, like, 15 minutes on Harry’s courtroom scene, which that could have been compressed down to to 2 minutes. Just like, oh, they say, you know, they say that you did this and he’s like, I I didn’t. And then Dumbledore comes in and he’s like, oh, we have this woman.
Okay. Gotta go. Bye. Well, the pacing for everything up to the first 20 minutes was, like, this is a normally paced movie. Yes.
It’s making sense. Yes. And then, like I said, at the 20 minute mark, which is, like, right after that, they’re, like, oh, shit. We know we have to now compress the 80% of the book in the next 40 minutes. It’s like, Oh, okay.
It’s like when you or I are taking ROWLs, we spend the first hour on the first three questions, and we’re like, wow. We really did a good job. And then you flip the page and you realize You’ve got a big another set of questions. You’re like, oh my god. And you just start circling things.
It’s kinda like half how this one felt. Did you have a favorite scene? Fred and George, scene even though the context wasn’t really great, the them leaving Hogwarts. I think that hit. I think that was pretty good.
Yeah. The whole I mean, not to bring more hates, but, like, the whole him nailing decrees into the wall, I don’t care. That was, like, 5 to 10 minutes of the film of him just showing him hammering. It’s, like, what is this who is this for? What does this matter?
Part of the montage. I don’t know. Maybe, like, stock up to Filters’ workout reg regimen because I feel like Filcher’s in the movie more than half the characters. Yeah. Not in the main characters.
Let’s be honest. Right? He was. Yeah. A 100%.
Yeah. Stock up to Filcher workouts. Well, he’s able to hammer those things with him. Yeah. That’s true.
You gotta respect it. Yeah. I guess, for me, my favorite scene, I don’t know, I guess, like, the hall of prophecy stuff, just to see all those prophecies everywhere, was pretty cool. The ministry itself, it’s our first look into the ministry, really. I did like the ministry as a whole.
I thought that was, like, a cool set and, like, setting. So, like, stuff that happened in there, I thought was was fun. I was it was unfortunate to me that we didn’t get more of the stuff going on with the Time Turners. I mean, when the guy’s head gets stuck in the Time Turner, it goes from, like, baby to old man or stuff like that. Wow.
That would have been cool to see. The whole brain situation with Ron would have been would have been cool to see. So it’s unfortunate it really just got chalked out to the the hall of prophecies with smoke monsters and then the veil room with smoke monsters. That that was unfortunate, but I did like the the ministry in general. And I thought the thestrals were were well done as as well.
Although the the the reason for them, they’re like, we gotta get out of here. Let’s fly. And it’s like, well, the thestrals have a good sense of direction. That’s why they’re important. And then they didn’t have their broons, which you don’t cover in because they don’t play Quidditch ever.
So Yeah. Like, the whole reason for them flying didn’t make any sense. So That’s that’s true. How did you feel about instead of Hagrid having a class with the thestrals and explaining it to them, it’s just like Luna and Harry in the Forbidden Forest and Luna giving the whole thestral talk. Yeah.
I didn’t I I was fine with that. I mean, she was just a great actress. I agree. I I have more Luna screen time I I wasn’t I wasn’t too upset about, which takes me to picking my character, which for this movie would, you know, similarly, we picked it for the book. But I thought Luna I I Lunar ombreage again for me.
Simple as that. It’s just Mhmm. It’s Lunar ombreage. I can do a montage about it, but I won’t. I want pound for pound or time on screen to impact Bellatrix.
Oh. I think she was she was more scary than Voldemort. Oh, Voldemort showed up, like, I don’t care. I wanna see more of Bellatrix. What she’s about?
Alright. Love, Hate. What do you got for love? I already mentioned it first, like, 20 minutes of movie. I thought it was very solid.
It was dark. It was kind of right to the point. I appreciate it. Although, I will say, I keep on looking out for Tonks because I remember you saying Tonks is Caroline’s favorite character. Mhmm.
And I was like, I don’t even know who Tonks is when you said that. I was like, I don’t remember her at all. Keep on waiting her to shine through, but when they introduce her in this, first of all, she’s super young. Secondly, I was like, is that Harry’s love interest in this movie? Because she was literally I fucking the shit out of him to to quote, wedding crashers.
Both of them, they were, like, flying and, like, winking at each other. But but I didn’t know this is the like, this new love interest in the movie. You mean when they’re super secretly wizard flying, like, through the streets of at the streets in the river Thames? And it’s like, what? Yeah.
It’s not very many people there. Don’t worry about that. It’s Caroline’s favorite character in the books, not necessarily the the movie. I feel like in the movie, she has whatever happens there. Didn’t she do, like, funny faces at Christmas, or is that in the next movie?
She did that. She was that was it. She was in the movie for the flying scene, and then she did, like, pig face, and they never showed her ever again. Yeah. It’s like, oh, she has the ability to make pig faces.
Weird. She’s much better in Game of Thrones. She plays the wildling Game of Thrones. Yep. Oh, that’s right.
Okay. Good call. Yeah. My first love was the direction of Ginny Weasley. So the director’s job of directing the the Ginny Weasley character.
Order of Phoenix should be the biggest movie yet for Ginny, and that’s saying something considering Well, the second movie, she should be, right? She should be in that as well, which she’s less of than in the book. But even in the book, she’s more of, like, bits and pieces of her in the background and then, like, her being really nervous or running off and stuff like that just to kinda lead up to the end. She’s not really having long conversations. It’s like someone asking, hey, Ginny, are you okay?
And then her being like, oh, I’m fine, but not being fine. Whereas in this book, she’s kinda starting to hang out with the gang. You know, she’s in the DA. She’s goes to the ministry with them. It’s a whole thing.
And, eventually, she’s Harry’s love interest. And, you know, this should be the really the movie that you ramp her up because she’s gonna be in the next one a lot or she should be with Harry’s growing love interest and then not really in the 7th one naturally because it’s kind of a Harry, Ron, and Hermione movie. But this one should be the one they really ramp her up in because she’s in the book a lot. Bonnie Wright, who plays Ginny, might be the worst actress I’ve ever seen in any movie ever. So I was really happy that they decided to just give her 0 lines and just have her look at the camera or look at a different character.
It was so well directed because I’m sure they had some lines for her and she opened up her mouth and they were like, Oh. You have no chemistry with Harry. You have no chemistry with movies, like being an actual actress. So unfortunately, we cast you when you’re 10 years old, so we can’t recast you. So we’re just gonna have to have you not say anything at all and just look around.
So so I was I was pretty pleased with that. I feel like this is a recurring thing that you keep on talking about how terrible she is, and she’s had in the 5 movies we’ve watched, she said 3 lines, like, to your point. So I’m like, I don’t know where you’re getting it from. So maybe in the next movie, that’s when you say it. Every time she’s on screen, I stare at her.
Yes. I’m like Exactly. Must be terrible at acting. That’s because you’ve you’ve led the witness. I’ve but, like, literally just staring at her being like, yeah.
She is doing something weird there. You’re right, D man. But I’m like, wait. Why am I looking at her? She’s not even talking.
But that’s the thing. It’s like every scene that she’s in, it’s like it has nothing to do with her, but you see her character because she’s just doing something out of sorts. It’s like she has earplugs in when other people are talking and is just, like, looking around confused at what’s happening as opposed to being like Yeah. Harry’s talking, Ginny, and he’s saying something that should frighten you, and she’s, like, sitting there smiling. It’s like she doesn’t she legitimately just doesn’t know what’s happening.
I don’t know if you’ve seen this on Instagram and they get there’s a clip of a guy going, like, I found this major flaw in Harry Potter. Watch here, and they just show Ginny Weasley as they this person doesn’t have a personality. Yeah. That’s it. 0 personality.
Yeah. Yeah. Zero personality. That’s great. I’m sure Bonnie Wright is a wonderful person, but it just has nothing, like, gives 0.
It it’s incredible performance. It’s amazing, actually. What are the what else do you feel love? The story choices were awful, but acting was great. So it wasn’t, like, their fault.
You know? So I also thought Harry did a, like, Harry gets better every movie acting wise. I agree. Caroline doesn’t think so. Caroline thinks he’s he’s bad.
I think he’s really good. I’ve seen him in there’s a one where he breaks out of prison. He’s amazing right there. I don’t know if you’ve seen that. I’ve seen that movie.
Yeah. He’s very good. Yeah. I was he’s the lead. He’s, like, on on screen the whole movie, and I’m like, this you’re like, oh, I forgot he’s an Harry Potter.
Like, you don’t think of him as Harry. He’s a South African. He’s doing the accent perfectly the whole movie. I think he gets better every movie. Mhmm.
So, yeah, I appreciate that, and we already mentioned all the other great casting. And the ending wasn’t terrible. I I or at least I don’t remember it being terrible. Oh, really? Oh, you hate it?
You have a bone effect. Okay. Good. Alright. Good.
We wanna get the streak alive. The end what was the actual, like, last scene ending? Oh, it’s like them walking by the Hogwarts Express? Yeah. The one thing that Voldemort doesn’t have is friendship.
And I was like, alright. I can I can at least live with that? That’s why they don’t have to worry. But the thing is, compared to last movie, it was so good. Yeah.
So did you have an issue with it? No. I didn’t necessarily have an issue with that that part. I thought that part was fine because that is a a main point of Harry Potter, so I’m glad they got it in there. It’s it’s that Dumbledore doesn’t have the capacity for love, compassion, friendship, like, all of the human traits that we hold to here.
Or are you talking about the actor Dumbledore? I always say Dumbledore instead of Voldemort. I don’t know why. Oh, the actor. I wouldn’t say that you’re wrong for that.
No. Michael Gambon, fuck you. No. No. Voldemort.
Voldemort doesn’t have the the capacity for those things, and and Harry is the equal and opposite to that. So even though, you know, Harry might not be as good of a wizard, he has the support of others, and because of that, you know, they’re able to prevail. So, yes, I’m fine with that. It was some other stuff that I didn’t like, which I’ll get into my hates anyways Okay. For the acting.
I continue to think that Emma Watson is not very good at acting. I don’t I don’t know about how you you feel like Hermione’s fine. Well, I saw the movie The Circle. Have you ever seen that? No.
It has, like, an all star cast as her, Tom Hanks. It’s everything about it, if you, like, read the description, everything I’ll think about it should be this movie’s gonna crush. And I would and she’s like the main person in it, and I was like Uh-huh. She is terrible at acting. Like, this is a terribly acted movie.
Mhmm. And, like, every time a part tells them that, they’re like, no. She’s great in Harry Potter. I’m like, I don’t think she’s good. I think it’s just she’s Hermione, so she’s good.
But acting wise, yikes. Yeah. I mean, one, they don’t give her enough lines to really, like you know, it it’s like she has one at bat and struck out. You’re like, oh, she’s terrible. So it’s not really that fair necessarily.
Every time she talks, it just seems like, I don’t know, like she’s just not very good. Like Ron, I think, is great and he has the same amount of lines. You know, he just plays that character really well. So I guess I’ll get into my hate. And it’s not necessarily the ending itself.
It’s the whole prophecy thing. I loved it in the book and we talked about it in the last podcast about the conversation between Harry and Dumbledore is maybe the best ever in the whole series. And we get a ton of lore. It’s like a really long conversation. We learn a lot about the future.
And in the movie, they decide for some reason that when Harry breaks the prophecy that he hears it. So we all hear it at the time, and then we’re just thinking about the prophecy as that whole fight is happening because I’m like, Wait, oh, what does that prophecy mean? You know, if I was hearing it for the first time, that’s what I’d be thinking. Where I feel like it would have been so much better to just do what the book did which is the prophecy breaks. No one hears it.
You can even say like, well, now the prophecy has lost forever. And then 10 minutes later, Dumbledore is like, actually, Harry, I do have the prophecy and I know it. And they jump into the pensive and they hear the whole thing. It makes it a bigger reveal there because then instead, he just, like, asked Dumbledore. He’s like, so the prophecy means that either Voldemort or I is gonna have to die?
And Dumbledore’s like, yep. And then it’s like, let’s go to the next scene. There’s just not this great long conversation between the 2 of them about the future and what this prophecy means and stuff like that that happens in the book. And it’s just really unfortunate because once again, it seemed like it was just a really quick scene that didn’t need to be quick, and that’s a really important scene that shouldn’t have been. Yeah.
Well, especially since it’s like the climax of the movie, you’re in this dark mysterious place. You don’t want that to be the most crucial lines to be said then. You want the action to seek for itself. You know, it just be, like, envelop you. You’re not, like, wait, what did they just can you replay that?
What did they just say within the props? That’s where you put that in a a still room and you have one camera on the one guy, one camera on the other person, they’re telling them that. Like that’s where you need that for, not all the stimuli going on and Yeah. No. I agree.
I I feel like we had just had this amazing battle. It’s like, oh shit, we didn’t get the prophecy out of it and then Harry and Dumbledore sit down. Dumbledore is like, oh, Harry. Actually, I was the one the prophecy was told to, like, step into the pensive. It’s like, oh, cool.
Like, now we’re gonna get it. So, yeah, unfortunate. What other what other hates? Dumbledore, awful. Just terrible.
I was thinking too. I was like, what’s good about this Dumbledore is, like, when I think I told you last one. I was like, when we get to the action scenes, that’s where he’s gonna shine. He’s gonna be much more, physical. And every action scene he’s in, he like, it has, like, a look of fear and, like, this isn’t gonna go well, like, acting work.
I’m, like Yeah. What? What’s what’s happening? Even when Trelawney gets fired, he’s, like, actually, like, you can stay here. And in the book, he’s, like, no, actually, I know what I’m talking about.
You don’t know shit. That’s why he comes in with that swagger Mhmm. And says you’re staying here, Trelawny. In the movie, he’s like, you can stay here, I think, Trelawny. And she’s like, well, I’m gonna change that rule.
And he’s like, oh, no. And he walks away being like, oh, no. What what do I do now? Like, that this is the weakest character I’ve ever seen. I don’t like, what is the point of Dumbledore?
He’s the weakest person. Just annoyed. Just annoyed with him. Not not enough swag for sure. He doesn’t have the dumb the dumby swag.
I couldn’t agree more. I don’t know why they they continue to, to to do this with the the movies, unfortunately. And 6th one, so I’m I’m interested to to see how that goes because, obviously, he’s he plays a much bigger part. Yeah. He dude, Yates is the director.
I we already talked about that a bunch of times. I’m not gonna say, you know, anything more on that. Couple little ones, Hermione calling Ron Ronald several times throughout this movie. Didn’t understand it. I don’t think she calls him Ronald once in the books, but she calls him Ronald.
When she’s, like, angry at him or something? Or Let’s listen for it in the books, I guess, but I don’t I don’t think so. And, I mean, even in the movie, the movie’s so short, she probably says him his name. She only has a few lines, and she calls him Ronald, I think, like, 3 different times. It was like, what?
What’s going on here? His name’s Ron, and you know his name’s Ron. Like, you wanna see him with his clothes off. Let’s not call him Ronald. And then the last one I had was when he Harry steps into the pensive to see the the Snape memory.
The the Snape with the toilet paper on his shoe gag, like, what is this? What are we doing here? Did you need to have the toilet paper on the shoe for Snape? That really bothered you. It did.
It just seemed like such low hanging fruit to to as a way to be like, oh, look at this idiot right here. It’s just such a stupid cartoon gag that they decided to do, and it’s also the wizarding world. Like, don’t they just vanish poo from their buttholes with a with a simple spell? Then you don’t need toilet paper. The toilet paper is never referenced.
Right? Is that correct? It must be. I’ve it has to be. Yeah.
It just doesn’t make any sense. It doesn’t make any that would you’re telling me in the 1000 of years of wand lore and all the jinxes and hexes and curses that people have created and all the ways they can do things with their wands that they didn’t don’t just vanish poof from their buttholes. They’re wearing, like, cloaks and they’re, like, discouraging, entrepreneurship kit. They’re probably, like, using outhouses still. They probably don’t even have, like, they’re, like, what is this whole system where you can flush things?
Like, the idea of the extendable ears, like like I said before, they’re like, so you put this thing in your ear and you can hear from further away. That’s been invented, like like, 1920. The microphone is invented. Right? Like, what if what’s going on?
Yeah. So Yeah. Those are the only things. I just thought the snake thing was it was just kinda silly and I don’t know. Alright.
My last one was, McGonigal knowing about this hand scar stuff and then just getting owned on the argument from Umbridge. Mhmm. The and also, like, there’s nothing more that annoys me than the whole when she was, like, stepping what taking one step up to show the arguments even and then one step. You know what I’m talking about? Like, so Umbra would make a point step up above.
I don’t know what that’s called but it’s called something. Yeah. Yeah. It’s called something but it we get it. Filmmakers would probably love it.
They’re like, look at this. It shows that, like, it’s like, yeah, but it’s so obvious. It’s not good if it’s that obvious. Like, the movie get out, if you, like, go back and listen to all, like, the stuff that’s in there Mhmm. And you’re like, holy shit.
That’s so smart. It’s, like, way above anything I could like, the second you watch it time you watch it, it’s almost better. Yeah. I agree. This is, like, you see that.
Oh, the first time I’m seeing it, and I’m like, that’s the dumbest thing ever. Oh, look. The subtlety there. It’s, like, the least subtle thing ever. And, also, it makes McGonagall, who’s another really strong character, looks super weak.
So didn’t care for it. Dumbledore and McGonagall both, like, strongest characters in the book are just so weak. Seems like the the one scene that they needed for McGonagall in this movie was when she gets reviewed by Umbridge, and she just owns Umbridge in the review scene. It’s like, oh, okay. Like, Minerva’s not getting stepped on by Dolores Umbridge, and, unfortunately, it just kinda goes the other way.
Oh, fuck. I see it. I get anger. I’m anger now. Why did we do this?
This is good. You don’t think about it after because I’ll keep thinking about it. Once you get it all out here, it’s over. Yeah. I don’t even wanna talk about studio notes or anything like that.
I did wanna shout out to Colin Bertram of the New York Daily News. I hope this man’s been fired. He gave the film a 4 out of 4 stars, calling it the best Harry Potter film yet and wrote that, and I quote, ‘Die hard Harry Potter addicts will rejoice that Yates has distilled J. K. Rowling’s broad universe with care and reverence.’ The complete and utter opposite of that, maybe like giant blade or a lightsaber.
No, a lightsaber is actually like, you know, maybe a rusty knife. A rusted, yeah, a rusted butter knife. Yeah. So whatever happened, that guy I don’t know what movie that guy was watching, and I think I’ve never known quicker that someone was not a diehard Harry Potter fan than by that review of him just telling what diehard Harry Potter fans are saying. Went into this not knowing what people thought of this movie.
So is this printed universally thought that it’s bad or good or one of the other? Because I went in and I was like, this is gonna be good. And I have no idea. It’s like a 7981 on Rotten Tomatoes. So I feel like people must like it and it made 900,000,000 out of a 150 to $200,000,000 budget, but the studio said they lost money on it.
I don’t know exactly how that works. So, yeah, I’m not I’m not really sure. I didn’t actually look too much into it because, like, I myself was just like, oh, wow. I’m so upset at how bad this movie was in in in my opinion. I got a one, listener email.
Okay. Shoot. You’ve got mail. This is from Jill in Houston. Oh.
She says now that we see how big giants actually are compared to humans Oh my god. Don’t. How did Hagrid’s dad and mom meet? Yeah. I know you Hagrid is a very an adult term, and I appreciate that you’re using that, Jill.
Fornicate. Yeah. That’s a good question. It is. So I assume went head first.
Right? Is that what we’re both assuming? Is that how babies are made? I don’t know still. So Yeah.
Well, I think if it was reversed, you know, if if he was the giant and In that position? Or No. If he was the if the father was the giant and the mom was the human or or, you know, wizard, whatever the case is, it would be more difficult. Although I think there are videos online that, you know, you could see, mister Hans being 1. Because considering it’s the the dad is the is the wizard and and the mom’s the giant, I I think it’s, you know, hot dog down the hallway situation.
Alright. Well, that that’s all I’m doing. Yeah. I mean It’s all that good shit. Health class must be really interesting in the wizarding world.
I’m just kinda surprised they don’t you know, they don’t have the important stuff really in at Hogwarts. It’s all the charms and defense against the dark arts when, really, we just need some, some health class. With all these these categories and all this conversation, would you recommend this movie? Or, I guess, what do you rate it? What do you how many buddies we give in this thing out of 4?
Probably like a 1.5 for me. It’s pretty low. I I think all the other 4 movies, the third one, I would probably give another chance just because how much everyone else likes it. So I’m probably giving that another chance down the road. All the other ones I’m continuing to watch the series 5, I’d almost put in the market a skip on that because it’s just I just did not think it was great.
I think we’re a similar mindset. I gave it 1.75 buddies on the 4 buddy scale. And really just because I think it’s a Harry Potter movie that it’s it’s tough for it to go lower. It was the worst movie I’ve watched this year, and I’ve watched about 70 movies. Oh, okay.
So Jesus. It it was tied technically at 1.75 with the original Dune movie, Dune made in 1984, which I might have to revisit that because I don’t think that movie was as bad as this movie. So maybe I’m not I’m not Jesus. Giving this low enough. Now that I think about how this movie was, Oh, wow.
Impressive. So 1.75 is is the worst. I’m usually pretty generous with you know, I’m fairly generous You’re being generous. Yeah. With with, like, that 0.25 extra.
Yeah. The mid tier ones. That that that’s unfortunate. But, hey. You know, we did it.
We made it through. How does it rank on on your movies? Is this your least favorite of all the movies, I assume? Yeah. I think it’s 4, 1, 2, 3, 5.
Yeah. I I think I have, like, 4, 3, 1, 2, 5 is I think what mine is. I can’t remember what I did for the last ones, but I know I like 3 a lot more than you did. It’s it’s the my least favorite for sure. So if that wasn’t clear from the last Yeah.
Check, watch, 45 minutes or an hour of of shitting on this movie. So if you also hated this movie, reach out to us and let us know. And if you liked it, please tell us why. But, Keith, what do we got coming up next? Harry Potter and the Half Blood Prince book wise, and then the movie after that, and then we’ll wrap it up with book 7 and, the 2 movies.
So Yeah. Looking forward to it. Very much so. We’re we’re, you know, on the final lap as it were, and I hadn’t read, you know, Half Blood Prince in a long time, and I am thoroughly enjoying it. I caught probably 2:2 hours today of it, and it was, and it was a really enjoyable you know it’s good when it’s the middle of football season, and I really love to, you know, catch up on some football stuff.
And instead, I was like, you know what? I just wanna listen to Harry Potter. So There you go. Yeah. We know we’re liking it then.
Alright. Well, if this was cathartic, I appreciate that and I’ll catch you like next week for for Half Blood Prince. I love it. Alright. Alright.
Bye now. Bye now.
